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Author Topic: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman  (Read 14820 times)
Digimon
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« Reply #15 on: January 08, 2017, 10:47:15 AM »

nice roadtrip!  great cab!

thanks for sharing Smiley
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Searching Zaccaria Stuff: Zaxxon CPO, JumpBug CPO or CPO Repro
next project: assemble Zaccaria Vanguard.
blackie63
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« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2017, 11:13:14 AM »

an interesting read thanks for posting did i notice the in the bottom of that cabinet the various voltage selection plugs don`t usually see them all together these days  Grin
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Pinge
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« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2017, 11:15:16 AM »

Yes the plugs are there, but as kralleman said... fun to have but 100% useless
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kralleman
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« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2017, 01:55:42 PM »

I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.
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Arch
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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2017, 02:02:11 PM »

Great roadtrip report, guys! Really enjoyed it!
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All I wanted was a Pepsi!
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smarty
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« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2017, 08:23:38 PM »

I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.

I just had a look at he schematics and theyíre very similar to other Atari games of this era. Take at look at the 3901ís at F2,D2 and E8, Iíve seen those all have a high failure rate, outputs usually stuck high or showing no signal, they control the Prom select lines & part of the reset circuit amongst others. These 3901ís all being faulty will contribute to the CPU watchdogging.

Also going from my previous repairs, if the RAMís are made by NEC iíd also say thereís a high chance they will be faulty.

Reading the MAME source file Roms at D1 & E1 contain the CPU program.

EDIT, if you have the prom version of the board they are locations at L1,L0,M1,M0,N1,N0,P1,P0. This is very similar to a Super Breakout board in PCB layout and design.

Good luck with the repair.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2017, 09:21:29 PM by smarty » Logged

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MOST WANTED CABS:
Pinge
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« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2017, 09:06:53 PM »

Kralle: So when you have this figured out you can fix my two superbreakout boards  lol
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kralleman
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« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2017, 12:34:10 AM »

Hehe yes I'll do that Smiley

Smarty: thanks a lot for looking at the source and schematics. I will get back to the board this week and will definitely check out those 3901 and the proms. I have the prom version though so not sure exactly what roms contain the first part of the code. I guess it's a rather early cab as the serial number is 660.
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kralleman
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« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2017, 05:29:56 PM »

Just adding some more pictures, mainly to test how well it works to attach pictures from google photos and to prove that Pinge was also there Smiley










The PCB had several patch cables:
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Pinge
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« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2017, 05:59:16 PM »

Hehe... my selfdriving volvo  Cheesy
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Pinge
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« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2017, 05:46:16 PM »

Can I ask you to take a few good in focus photos of the control panel? Yours appears to have all the overlay text on it around the buttons, there are very photos online showing the detail of the CP.

Ok, I took some photos of the controlpanel today, if you need better/different photos let me know.





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kralleman
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« Reply #26 on: January 12, 2017, 12:45:35 AM »

I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.

I just had a look at he schematics and theyíre very similar to other Atari games of this era. Take at look at the 3901ís at F2,D2 and E8, Iíve seen those all have a high failure rate, outputs usually stuck high or showing no signal, they control the Prom select lines & part of the reset circuit amongst others. These 3901ís all being faulty will contribute to the CPU watchdogging.

Also going from my previous repairs, if the RAMís are made by NEC iíd also say thereís a high chance they will be faulty.

Reading the MAME source file Roms at D1 & E1 contain the CPU program.

EDIT, if you have the prom version of the board they are locations at L1,L0,M1,M0,N1,N0,P1,P0. This is very similar to a Super Breakout board in PCB layout and design.

Good luck with the repair.

I finally got some time to sit down with this. The timer reset signal (outputted from pin 12 on the 9301@E8) is constantly high. It should be pulsing in order for the watchdog to stop barking. I'm not sure if it's the 9301 itself that is bad or the input that is provided to it. Input pins 1, 14 and 15 are pulsing with nice pulses, but input pin 2 is constantly high. Tracing that one back to pin 8 of the 7432@P3, I see that the WRITE signal coming in at pin 9 is pulsing nicely but the input at pin 10 of the 7432 is constantly high. This one is outputted from the 9301@D2 (pin 7) which is indeed outputted constantly high. All the inputs (pins 1,2,14 and 15) of the 9301@D2 are pulsing nicely.

It seems as if the 9301@D2 is bad, but then again, I find that datasheet a little bit difficult to look at (I am still quite a newbie when it comes to TTLs).

So... Ehm... What do I replace those with? I found one seller on eBay that had some in stock but if it is possible to get a hold of some without having to wait for the overseas shipping and spending those ridiculous shipping costs it would be awesome Smiley
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Etienne MacGyver
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« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2017, 11:08:47 AM »

Dominos is awesome, i think Level42 has/had one. (do you still have it Andre ?)

Here a old video when my son was playing dominos on mame (skip to 8 minutes), sjeez the time go fast, that has been 5 years ago.




By the way, that serial tag is missing in my collection, can you provide a straight pic of both of them with measurements in mm. please ?
It looks they are both aluminium right ?

« Last Edit: January 12, 2017, 11:12:52 AM by Etienne MacGyver » Logged
kralleman
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« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2017, 11:57:41 AM »

I only took the PCB with me home and the cabinet is in storage quite far from here. Maybe Pinge who is closer to it can take a photo the next time he's there.
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Pinge
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« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2017, 02:34:59 PM »

I will try to get a photo this week.
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