Dragon's Lair Fans - Arcade Lifestyle

General Chat => Arcade Lifestyle => Topic started by: Pinge on January 07, 2017, 11:40:45 AM



Title: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 07, 2017, 11:40:45 AM
Ok, I´ve noticed that there been som disappoitment that there are to low activity on this forum lately, so to contribute we documented our roadtrip yesterday.
Nothing extra, just some pictures from the Swedish Winter.

Kralleman came to my hometown the day before so we could start early, I overslept and we were not in the car 06:00 as planned but 06:20 is good enough.
The temperature was -12c and along the way it dropped and peaked at -21c... inside the car it was +22  ;D
And ofcourse I drive a "swedish" Volvo V50, built in the factory in Belgium  :lol:
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/001_zpscyjxtphr.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/001_zpscyjxtphr.jpg.html)

The destination was Stockholm, only four hours away... I took the wheel cause I only had some wine the night before, kralleman on the other hand drank both tequila and beer
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/002_zpstcpb4fzl.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/002_zpstcpb4fzl.jpg.html)

You cant drive through Sweden without passing atleast one IKEA, this is one of three we passed on our journey
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/003_zpsluoyxmkm.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/003_zpsluoyxmkm.jpg.html)

Välkommen Till Stockholm, Thank you
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/004_zps4oibdyfa.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/004_zps4oibdyfa.jpg.html)

At the sellers house, freezing cold so Kralleman decide to put his scarf on. 2112 is one of his favorite bars in Gothenburgh if someone wonders.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/006_zpsynid35xt.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/006_zpsynid35xt.jpg.html)

AND HERE IT IS, the game we came for, only game the seller ever had apart from an old 70´s Pinball. Alot of random junk in his garage, but nothing of interest.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/007_zpsdkrbbxfj.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/007_zpsdkrbbxfj.jpg.html)

It had Swedish instructions, thank god, impossible for us to figure out how to play otherwise
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/008_zpslz7nx8u7.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/008_zpslz7nx8u7.jpg.html)

Serial-sticker intact,  always nice.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/009_zpsyby3e8ui.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/009_zpsyby3e8ui.jpg.html)

Ok, its not working, and not minty. Another cabinet with a Motorola monitor, always good to get something you have worked on before Kralleman says.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/010_zpson67b30j.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/010_zpson67b30j.jpg.html)
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/011_zps5devcyzq.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/011_zps5devcyzq.jpg.html)

Lets load it up, here is the nice seller in the background, he invited us for coffee when the deal was done.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/012_zpsmqjd2jov.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/012_zpsmqjd2jov.jpg.html)

Its a small car but i easily hold a Dominos, for the record a V50 also can transport Donkey Kong-style cabinets and midway Pacman..
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/013_zpsqlsgspgl.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/013_zpsqlsgspgl.jpg.html)
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/014_zpsfbsakpkj.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/014_zpsfbsakpkj.jpg.html)

OK, back on the Road, this time Kralleman is the driver since he sobered up from last night.  :-*
One of atleast six broken-down cars we saw along the way, notice the old civilian police-car. They dont even make SAAB anymore...
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/015_zps553abv1k.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/015_zps553abv1k.jpg.html)

Swedish Defence, almost ready for an invasion
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/016_zpstrxtwqkd.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/016_zpstrxtwqkd.jpg.html)

We stopped at the Swedish town of Arboga for a lunch, DLF member vr6an lives here, we should have called him but didnt... (Sorry Roger om du läser detta)
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/017_zpshqzrrk30.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/017_zpshqzrrk30.jpg.html)

Unloaded at the warehouse where we keep some of our games
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/018_zpsrpr1v5ej.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/018_zpsrpr1v5ej.jpg.html)

One last inspection before a quick test, as expected it did not work, voltages and B+ are fine and the monitor lights up with a grey screen, Kralleman took the PCB with him home to gothenburg to check it and hopefully fix it on his testbench.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/020_zpsqqwr7zx1.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/020_zpsqqwr7zx1.jpg.html)

We placed it Next to one of my projects....
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff382/Pinge80/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/019_zpsrq60yw1x.jpg) (http://s1233.photobucket.com/user/Pinge80/media/Arkadspel/2017%20Atari%20Dominos%20Med%20kralleman/019_zpsrq60yw1x.jpg.html)

So that is about it, hope you enjoyed it... please comment if you have suggestions how you like the roadtrips in the future documented, we have atleast four more pickups to do in the not to distant future.
If I find the time and you find it interesting a could post some of last years roadtrips!

And I wont excuse the bad english, I guess it´s better than most of your Swedish  :wink:


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 07, 2017, 11:59:38 AM
Thanks for the company! Always a pleasure. Great job on the write-up too.

Tested the board yesterday. It syncs and shows garbage symbols on the screen. Was too tired to do anything more with it.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: old school on January 07, 2017, 12:03:50 PM
Way to go guys

It's always nice to read Road Trip   ;)

and by the way your english is far better than my swedish too   ;D ;D


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: retrocab on January 07, 2017, 12:06:35 PM
yeah looks good with the pictures

looking forward to trhe next one

gr from the netherlands


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Belike on January 07, 2017, 02:52:38 PM
Nice and rare cab, looks like 100% original inside also. :)
Pretty huge warehouse you have there :D
Volvo rocks! ;D


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Luigi on January 07, 2017, 03:44:38 PM
Really nice one guys, both the road trip (incl. documentation) and the cab :) I really love Dominos and I'm sorry I had to let it go  :'(

Good luck with the repair! :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Superully on January 07, 2017, 04:07:33 PM
thx for the roadtrip report, it was nice reading something new. some nice pics as well, love the snow-covered tank ;). oh, and by the way, what type of indiana jones-que warehouse is that? be careful that COW doesn't steal it from underneath your nose, rumor has it they are buying EVERYTHING these days ...  :P


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 07, 2017, 05:03:32 PM
The games is the warehouse are not for sale, so COW can go look somewhere else  8)



Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Laszo on January 07, 2017, 05:06:53 PM
Thanks for the nice roadtrip report, looks mighty cold out there... Keep us posted on the repair.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Superully on January 07, 2017, 06:07:58 PM
The games is the warehouse are not for sale, so COW can go look somewhere else  8)

COW is not interested in the games, they are interested in the WAREHOUSE itself  ;D


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 07, 2017, 06:49:21 PM
 :lol:
That is not for sale either, it actually belongs to my work.

I hope kralleman keep you updated on the repair, which reminds me that I should get going with some of my projects... they are closer to 20 than 10 after all purchases last year  :-\


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: smarty on January 07, 2017, 07:39:17 PM
Nicely done! I have one of these cabs on my radar this year, It has no game board or monitor chassis but will scrub up well and look great next to my Jet Fighter.

Can I ask you to take a few good in focus photos of the control panel? Yours appears to have all the overlay text on it around the buttons, there are very photos online showing the detail of the CP.

Well done for saving this one, I hope the PCB fix isn't to difficult.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: DarthNuno on January 08, 2017, 09:19:56 AM
Many thanks for this road trip report! It has all needed :fun, local stuff (Ikea  ;D), food, a season one (love these winter pictures), and a nice reward : a rare  Atari Dominos! Good job on this  8)

 :spaceace: :spaceace: :spaceace:


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 08, 2017, 09:32:45 AM
Thanks for the kind words, It makes me want to post more, sadly previous roadtrips are not that well documented, but its pictures of us and the games anyways. :)

I will go to the warehouse and take better photos of the CPO (and rest of the cabinet)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: slowcade on January 08, 2017, 09:33:40 AM
Thank you for this nice roadtrip report! I really enjoyed it.  :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Digimon on January 08, 2017, 10:47:15 AM
nice roadtrip!  great cab!

thanks for sharing :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: blackie63 on January 08, 2017, 11:13:14 AM
an interesting read thanks for posting did i notice the in the bottom of that cabinet the various voltage selection plugs don`t usually see them all together these days  ;D


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 08, 2017, 11:15:16 AM
Yes the plugs are there, but as kralleman said... fun to have but 100% useless


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 08, 2017, 01:55:42 PM
I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Arch on January 08, 2017, 02:02:11 PM
Great roadtrip report, guys! Really enjoyed it!


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: smarty on January 08, 2017, 08:23:38 PM
I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.

I just had a look at he schematics and they’re very similar to other Atari games of this era. Take at look at the 3901’s at F2,D2 and E8, I’ve seen those all have a high failure rate, outputs usually stuck high or showing no signal, they control the Prom select lines & part of the reset circuit amongst others. These 3901’s all being faulty will contribute to the CPU watchdogging.

Also going from my previous repairs, if the RAM’s are made by NEC i’d also say there’s a high chance they will be faulty.

Reading the MAME source file Roms at D1 & E1 contain the CPU program.

EDIT, if you have the prom version of the board they are locations at L1,L0,M1,M0,N1,N0,P1,P0. This is very similar to a Super Breakout board in PCB layout and design.

Good luck with the repair.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 08, 2017, 09:06:53 PM
Kralle: So when you have this figured out you can fix my two superbreakout boards  :lol:


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 09, 2017, 12:34:10 AM
Hehe yes I'll do that :)

Smarty: thanks a lot for looking at the source and schematics. I will get back to the board this week and will definitely check out those 3901 and the proms. I have the prom version though so not sure exactly what roms contain the first part of the code. I guess it's a rather early cab as the serial number is 660.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 09, 2017, 05:29:56 PM
Just adding some more pictures, mainly to test how well it works to attach pictures from google photos and to prove that Pinge was also there :)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/MaLxZE0aczan0Sv1WvehUH5cASWDvaik-YPEwSiHe8-kFBg6nB6mMLPdsPr0mibnf-MnvvrfluIekjpMR_6LyUnDE2TUMTNBX6hGMpQf_lx2-0JGLyuJo22kkupQsSPOnDeb2Kdbx3l9LWyAlpsOkPBCEI2JARnhQtlZv7MvUHi1oSPK5kQbM3unh0B8s545etIDgWG52rrZkfwBI1ieq1W7ho65eyZYf91qytBUXHJM8CHbsxHR-1dFBh6fLOxqKWN3hjI9F9w6Tf_2Mdx_HlOngmSzVTADMmOHqDnp_EeVcazJhuENJL-clMzqdCCu3MgRz14AvRdUSPXE1Juu88r2khuSS_gwtjVgTRADTQY2Mx2pDGXLwccOVAVTdR6UBgTeeDovlI1wV_4epkpHIhzqkCxsw1MGUXXX8Gf1GuBRDBJNFXu_U_tJ8qUOolKu6TL6XboRhCECRRbg7hyR1N6eMk0LaoaXWN4GtIDtapj_1LQoi7bXDbW1m3Ne1yIGRN9WaOykKmitMNwY_k7QmhrbRypL0O2Eq4FMnSutKkMJZdx6Lc3gm2IZklbloFbiZT1d6tzPRK_vOINFp_aSOX4s8n1AhWXjQ4Qe2LUC65AFVdBnJCs9A6nxeEVychfXB0oI8KG_lEdxCmRwKrf1N3KtH1YavX0i-8aSzQRRDIw=w720-h404-no)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/ie-RLdz9T8zKuMzdcEamvW9xaKlwEGOQM0mT3iBNP9WJDutb9FsJY1LntmMssFpi8Z9DMwR_IMs21gJsx2_yzKjQUT0nyUb3107UxZZrlRbSWexFjSIwJj9ELZ82RiPtU8Jqz3G0F_yohaPFkSL7DweWmLFQ0PMq1ddNnQdNoh4HHAe-kyArRwLRCWZduhsatxXCte_X7K82TuYJ5h15xc5GSPdZjM-HD5ya7R3qGbDb25VcW8C-EFL69Y27hpIDr-aarAt5UggxKibPgdSdetXcNtLJlQHPOIC6lK775H2Ce9c2ttkZZaAPUAbuHkmxJHqVKFzZiTJgMSrp2SJv-VdF1KEJ8M8OkY6q4_Ffx__liv9e89N22ucp61QOMdzx-QH1ZjNPwbuEOkjRStA8OmnpxvfKlVj0InF9NrzBj8uDZvMNTcFEdi_95hvjijnbQNCBBo4wolRU13j8uJwkV6quz-AQQAdszMUH_vfVZKGv7e1tb3U9oeseqvQ9AhlY5Gt5YhCuoIlPWJMopxiD-i2mR0unvyLtIycnHl4Q34fmWN_a22DQFtvK9cuEDyGdpTxkHynnjsaTkUbk7NmEQ8Lb24Oq2fdg4cci8hHAOx2XOuyOFfht_xBsBPVSnGy1OfTG9WEsenW-4Ynw7rW9R7-TuPkAn91FQhKV0D2OkEg=w720-h404-no)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/DzmLL4hMjobZBSwNtKHbfpt-2rgUhSDDkzd05p7JK4F4EDA-8HzTRlBNYzGJLMc5P-YmsRZ7vPO9xMqDX-Z3xaEGAKm1rLeKSlqCNiejOoio35brTe45j9LkynmXsk_Z44fGgXlmbuVbJk7oFaWbUuIejrRujjnV0xblen_l5cWUvt1Wts1Ubw7B_6zCE6MYrwzonRJoQFN0RNydUA0rqnqu97rM0cwQUTypMya6ihPCcCQVe0mmXYVNFAvssMGlJhMYP45emlW3-Q9ET7LIeSmOg_y89jUAc8yhwklNTcceLvKkoyTk3cuVkgZQLLuan_mh6wgQfFk437FY5XOAUuU41TfdJQycK7z9CQTGGsPOHtUijZ6pE1HbLoRK8nj6BSl6iSZQNBtBX95rLb6FRszvgKA241qfa2ZFV2jVKrvAQDR3FRzqyI2PvnZcDgiXT-PcvZlX2tHxaQ4sqyE8zu6Ne5sV0MBNbCx7y9FcnQC2OEp-mj6JBAf9LgH9zD8qBV7sqdz3_cEAxBvSH3BqG5OgNr0KoZZnZaOGD98Dn-uhzkbRfrbhRep3mof0zpUv0xbIXscaYqyhsBmy17majwnqi_YiQhEMFg5MJKXgp-IwfvlTV8wfhmL-ucf9TiXYUpJ_mFjuoSROcBWYpqfxuBEuPcn17FNli7JrUBatrxQ=w720-h404-no)


(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/RgsfOzRL0CM4Pg6P1K_RSmhyssVXh1CPG1nCneGSZnNyaPRpnApsrw-3jr-TVrTuErjJ_XEmVhn6LCvSEGuI1R8n-VQynYnZUTjMPsm0RdY5MKEsHuY5T1M_tRyqnOJOEihGKxw3HigpZmSe6yzJV5OpOliy-3HTAVM-DHg8EOOMChSrDBf6DnBglpDX0UmLZz1Xs-znSkwVEJaBGMcOE5f-1NBf0icaosI9Lvf33cP9u7acYA8fwH0l8ujr8ZMKnKQO75xbmhrkhKWhqfj76wirM90GQoZ5sPacOEBOzfOM9xHeyPBCE1g0Sv-ZHOf74LwBk6fgYkDz13r5Vbg8z9slcBukqXfvTZSUz1QE7Kyz88Iu4K0ktVqjTqd0sUXgYWuE1UhhN48gAEKmxaAy4PQ3w7QGnDY5YZZHHQVoHFP8fVn1jgHkdjvEZQHMyNmjpovN8_QRUvR77xrSjc50A37n4NWcE8zvKDZf1cc23MZIKD_8in24v8pTKLpRIqwQ0iZNz0pHfwIyw-m0WLIAW2BwKU1U2IJkUUxu6CZUr7IVTrVYxQDs_mtEGsEX7wpRS0DzrX4b8k4a05_6H7o7ZfTGJqkI7VOiOOK_MNik2t_nZ8enZ7QAENXI3nC6varmSJ2E7zH9YXMbUST1tVfxRZSypvTpsgs-8eH0Pq_CZl4=w720-h404-no)

The PCB had several patch cables:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/tCX-P93Sd1IRJ7-rLuKvDOI3TvcLhqu8dcKZX-3RV7Yqx8cX-IaB51g3zK0pMiUXV0CrG1FFFVNC5JgnO0MztfhCVFr56u9zaJFZGj05cmx94z4v4JuyCBqWyZDLKXVl_7-3WOvnw0tfNcATDgMb_phQnj6Ll5tvyuFDQT9wornIE3pvH3Xhu5nzM2y4Y-v09ArPC85DynQrMQQN0Go0BODplXH68Uz2RrcD5jlwadMe-aNErsKjufVu7c5vDbKkB48jd9425NP3yj4qXYTX6SEqINol1im1tsUPPCqW36rTWL7I4y3v7il5xTGWQU2qVo04kbd2lpm7o86xhxpVuIR7swL2W7huS8b8PizUCKbVQkcwvqjxwYWlbdhlgRDYSVdBKo0M6OhwgAuHNVw_OSGp137d_yx3771MnjshSQyRJSk9X6RVtmGNyN2RCM-fl0TV1mdD9lm8kWlMqli8Rl_6kwALj5WB5mu-3uL2xWv-6_gdkgFORuJbPpx6FmIUT66fhxDb4fJWEkcMS3Fwd2ACKPCs14j3Q55y3htTg3DOMxhB1qs4CzneXb-NNqOyetdGyRE569fKLkloN6qoGP8LIP3iswVdQEKR5ZIqQQez63qkCJcSS3MijbVcWYdj5EjaVNkl6RW0rfjuy8QNNO2m3FTeCIUdgNKHYLB9gtQ=w228-h404-no)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 09, 2017, 05:59:16 PM
Hehe... my selfdriving volvo  :D


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 10, 2017, 05:46:16 PM
Can I ask you to take a few good in focus photos of the control panel? Yours appears to have all the overlay text on it around the buttons, there are very photos online showing the detail of the CP.

Ok, I took some photos of the controlpanel today, if you need better/different photos let me know.

(http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-1.jpeg?width=150) (http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-1)
(http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-2.jpeg?width=150) (http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-2)
(http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-3.jpeg?width=150) (http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-3)
(http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-4.jpeg?width=150) (http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-4)
(http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-5.jpeg?width=150) (http://forumbilder.se/G74A9/atari-dominos-5)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 12, 2017, 12:45:35 AM
I had some time yesterday to look more into the pcb troubles. When plugged in, the screen shows garbage letters and digits. The watchdog is barking at the 6502 as often as it can so the CPU is being constantly reset. There seems to be activity on all address and data lines, both on CPU side of things and on RAM/ROM side. I can't see any stuck pins on ram/roms. One is floating on one of the rams but it's not supposed to be connected to anything. I tried replacing the cpu but it did not help. I only used my logic probe yesterday but I guess I need to start scoping things out. I might also try to disable the watchdog just to see what happens. There's no watchdog disable signal on the schematics but I guess I could just tie the output to gnd (it's then inverted before reaching the cpu), or?

The roms seem to be mask roms. I don't have the board nearby atm and don't quite remember the model. Anyway, I bet my shitty eprom programmer won't be able to read them.

Rams are 2102a. I don't have any spares or otherwise I wouldve tried piggybacking.

The problem with the reset is present both when test mode is on and off so I guess it's related to something early on in the boot process. I'm not sure what roms are responsible for what.

I just had a look at he schematics and they’re very similar to other Atari games of this era. Take at look at the 3901’s at F2,D2 and E8, I’ve seen those all have a high failure rate, outputs usually stuck high or showing no signal, they control the Prom select lines & part of the reset circuit amongst others. These 3901’s all being faulty will contribute to the CPU watchdogging.

Also going from my previous repairs, if the RAM’s are made by NEC i’d also say there’s a high chance they will be faulty.

Reading the MAME source file Roms at D1 & E1 contain the CPU program.

EDIT, if you have the prom version of the board they are locations at L1,L0,M1,M0,N1,N0,P1,P0. This is very similar to a Super Breakout board in PCB layout and design.

Good luck with the repair.

I finally got some time to sit down with this. The timer reset signal (outputted from pin 12 on the 9301@E8) is constantly high. It should be pulsing in order for the watchdog to stop barking. I'm not sure if it's the 9301 itself that is bad or the input that is provided to it. Input pins 1, 14 and 15 are pulsing with nice pulses, but input pin 2 is constantly high. Tracing that one back to pin 8 of the 7432@P3, I see that the WRITE signal coming in at pin 9 is pulsing nicely but the input at pin 10 of the 7432 is constantly high. This one is outputted from the 9301@D2 (pin 7) which is indeed outputted constantly high. All the inputs (pins 1,2,14 and 15) of the 9301@D2 are pulsing nicely.

It seems as if the 9301@D2 is bad, but then again, I find that datasheet a little bit difficult to look at (I am still quite a newbie when it comes to TTLs).

So... Ehm... What do I replace those with? I found one seller on eBay that had some in stock but if it is possible to get a hold of some without having to wait for the overseas shipping and spending those ridiculous shipping costs it would be awesome :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Etienne MacGyver on January 12, 2017, 11:08:47 AM
Dominos is awesome, i think Level42 has/had one. (do you still have it Andre ?)

Here a old video when my son was playing dominos on mame (skip to 8 minutes), sjeez the time go fast, that has been 5 years ago.

(http://img.youtube.com/vi/D6mceTPMSvc/0.jpg) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6mceTPMSvc)
(http://www.opdenkelder.com/pics/player.jpg) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6mceTPMSvc)

By the way, that serial tag is missing in my collection (https://www.easywebshop.com/arcadedecals/webshop/218388-atari#), can you provide a straight pic of both of them with measurements in mm. please ?
It looks they are both aluminium right ?

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/RgsfOzRL0CM4Pg6P1K_RSmhyssVXh1CPG1nCneGSZnNyaPRpnApsrw-3jr-TVrTuErjJ_XEmVhn6LCvSEGuI1R8n-VQynYnZUTjMPsm0RdY5MKEsHuY5T1M_tRyqnOJOEihGKxw3HigpZmSe6yzJV5OpOliy-3HTAVM-DHg8EOOMChSrDBf6DnBglpDX0UmLZz1Xs-znSkwVEJaBGMcOE5f-1NBf0icaosI9Lvf33cP9u7acYA8fwH0l8ujr8ZMKnKQO75xbmhrkhKWhqfj76wirM90GQoZ5sPacOEBOzfOM9xHeyPBCE1g0Sv-ZHOf74LwBk6fgYkDz13r5Vbg8z9slcBukqXfvTZSUz1QE7Kyz88Iu4K0ktVqjTqd0sUXgYWuE1UhhN48gAEKmxaAy4PQ3w7QGnDY5YZZHHQVoHFP8fVn1jgHkdjvEZQHMyNmjpovN8_QRUvR77xrSjc50A37n4NWcE8zvKDZf1cc23MZIKD_8in24v8pTKLpRIqwQ0iZNz0pHfwIyw-m0WLIAW2BwKU1U2IJkUUxu6CZUr7IVTrVYxQDs_mtEGsEX7wpRS0DzrX4b8k4a05_6H7o7ZfTGJqkI7VOiOOK_MNik2t_nZ8enZ7QAENXI3nC6varmSJ2E7zH9YXMbUST1tVfxRZSypvTpsgs-8eH0Pq_CZl4=w720-h404-no)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 12, 2017, 11:57:41 AM
I only took the PCB with me home and the cabinet is in storage quite far from here. Maybe Pinge who is closer to it can take a photo the next time he's there.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 12, 2017, 02:34:59 PM
I will try to get a photo this week.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: smarty on January 12, 2017, 07:09:35 PM
@Pinge, thanks for those CP images, It gives me an idea of what one should look like. They are great for now, at some point I may like a close up of the Domino logo in the middle so I can reproduce it.

@Kralleman, You're making progress well done :) So the 7432 at P3 is an or gate, if either input is high you will get a high output, because pin 10 is always high the output will be held high. Like you say tracing that back to the 9301 at D2 show all of those input signals on pins 1,2,14, & 15 are pulsing it is highly likely D2 is faulty. You'd really need a logic analyser to confirm the timing of the input signals which should trigger the output on pin 7, be in reality I'd say swap D3 out and forget about needing any higher tech knowledge.

These 9301's are not available anywhere anymore I'd be interested to see what data sheet you found and what that seller was actually selling?

Take a look at my Super Breakout repair thread I just posted in the tech forum. I've had a batch of boards made up to replace the 9301 with a 7442 which is essentially the same device with a different pinout and is readily available, PM me your address and I'll send you a few of them :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 12, 2017, 07:46:06 PM
I can try yo take a better photo of the cpo/logo this week aswell.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 12, 2017, 09:44:14 PM
...
@Kralleman, You're making progress well done :) So the 7432 at P3 is an or gate, if either input is high you will get a high output, because pin 10 is always high the output will be held high. Like you say tracing that back to the 9301 at D2 show all of those input signals on pins 1,2,14, & 15 are pulsing it is highly likely D2 is faulty. You'd really need a logic analyser to confirm the timing of the input signals which should trigger the output on pin 7, be in reality I'd say swap D3 out and forget about needing any higher tech knowledge.

I hooked up my scope and the signals going into D2 are looking like clean pulses (as opposed to just garbage). I have an old logic analyser stashed away in the attic but I have yet to make some room for it and learn how to use it. Saving that for a rainy day :)

Quote
These 9301's are not available anywhere anymore I'd be interested to see what data sheet you found and what that seller was actually selling?

The datasheet was this one (http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/130142/NSC/9301.html) and the eBay auction for NOS ones is found here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-NS-DM9301J-BCD-decoder-CERDIP16-qty-1-Ship-in-USA-tomorrow-/290747862000?hash=item43b1ec4bf0:g:8GYAAMXQUmFSo6jI).

Quote
Take a look at my Super Breakout repair thread I just posted in the tech forum. I've had a batch of boards made up to replace the 9301 with a 7442 which is essentially the same device with a different pinout and is readily available, PM me your address and I'll send you a few of them :)

Seriously? Wow that's awesome! PM is coming your way in a minute :) I will read through your SB thread too.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 23, 2017, 11:45:48 PM
I got the replacement for the 9301 from Smarty today! Thanks a lot, I owe you! :)

Unfortunately, my problem persists after I swapped the 9301@D2 for the new replacement. The output from pin 7 is still high which in turns pulls the output at pin 8 from the 7432@P3 high. The inputs to the 9301 (as well as the new replacement) at pins 1, 2, 14 and 15 all have clean pulses when I look at them with a scope. I'm confused. Could the clean-looking pulses coming into the 9301 be incorrect?

EDIT: Actually, the signals of the pins 1, 14 and 15 (the three that have signals coming from the 6401(?) decoder) of the 9301 all look very similar in when looked at in a scope. The signal on pin 2 (the one marked R/W) is the only one that differs. It looks to me that at least one of the three signals coming from the decoder needs to differ in order for pin 7 of the 9301 to ever go low. For pin 7 to go low, if I understood the datasheet of the 9301 correctly, the following needs to happen:

Input Pin1: Low
Input Pin2: High (the only one with a signal that seems to differ)
Input Pin14: Low
Input Pin15: High

As it looks right now, pins 1, 14 and 15 go low at the same time and high at the same time. Then again, my scope is from the seventies or something and the picture isn't the sharpest :)


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: Pinge on January 24, 2017, 07:30:28 AM
Your game is from the seventies aswell so the scope should be fine  :lol:


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: smarty on January 24, 2017, 07:25:09 PM
 Shame the IC didn't fix the problem, I will try and digest what you've written in the next few day and think of some other areas you can't test. I'll take a look at the Ops manual as they are pretty descriptive in he theory of operation for these early boards.

Can you confirm that the pin that is stuck high isn't shorted to the 5v rail probably on a trace on the underside of the PCB or any other signal nearby.

Give the ROM legs a clean too with a light rub from some sandpaper or similar if you haven't already.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on January 25, 2017, 12:34:56 AM
Thanks for the input! I am in no hurry so no rush in digging through the manual. I am just thankful that you want to juggle this problem with me at all :) I will go back to the manual myself and have a look.

I double checked the line now to see if it was shorted to 5v or anything nearby. I couldn't find anything in between the 7432@P3 and the 9301@D2 that it was shorted to. I also checked the 7432 to see if it was maybe internally shorted and same with the 9301-replacement. No shorts there either. The 7432@P3 is a bit burnt on its legs, could it be bad without showing a short between pin 10 and any other pin?

I gave the pins of the ROM and the pins of the 7432 some love now too. I'm finding that a fiberglass pen is great for that sort of cleanup tasks. Board is still showing same symptoms though.

Also worth mentioning is that I have this rigged to a switching ps on my test bench and that I am only supplying the PCB with +5v from that (i.e. no 12v or -5 or anything like that is connected). I'm pretty sure that I looked at the schematics to verify that no odd voltages should be required for these parts of the circuits.


Title: Re: Roadtrip 6/1-2017 Atari Dominos Pickup for Kralleman
Post by: kralleman on February 14, 2017, 11:38:38 PM
A small update: tried replacing the 7432 @p3 but it did not change anything. Will have to allocate some more time for this pcb soon.