Author Topic: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???  (Read 35246 times)

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #15 on: December 26, 2010, 11:58:17 PM »
Left of that there is the cap we Italian means...it's C18.

thx for pointing it out to me. so we're talking C18 here (i was on the right track). but to be honest, this cap looks totally fine to me - i can't (physically) see any damage. i'm going to replace it nevertheless though!

all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

italiandoh

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #16 on: December 27, 2010, 12:42:05 AM »
thx matteo for checking it out. are there any manuals / schematics for the monitor?

Send me your e-mail and I'll reply with a Xmas gift ;)

Matteo

Etienne MacGyver

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #17 on: December 27, 2010, 06:58:09 AM »
thx for pointing it out to me. so we're talking C18 here (i was on the right track). but to be honest, this cap looks totally fine to me - i can't (physically) see any damage. i'm going to replace it nevertheless though!


Yes, that happens alot, they look fine, but as you can see under the transistor, the board is a little brownish..
that is many times comming from heat, so you can bet that after all those years next to a heatsource that its dried out.

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2011, 02:29:44 PM »
here are the results of the cap kit (i'm also posting this in my paperboy thread; remember: the picture wasn't perfect (shaky etc.)). while the screen looks nice now (except for the bad colors which are caused by something else), it didn't fix one problem which i had hoped it would: the vertical size. as you can see on the following picture, the screen is too wide and i wasn't able to adjust it with any knob turning >:(



is it possible that this is caused by a bad big blue? there are two of them in the bottom of the cabinet, one on and one next to the power supply. i didn't even know there were games with two big blues. anyway, i've already ordered replacements (as spares) from bob roberts, perhaps i should exchange them now! could this be the cause of the screen problem?

all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

Etienne MacGyver

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #19 on: January 04, 2011, 03:56:25 PM »
I dont think so, the big blue is not in the circuit of the monitor but at the low voltage area to your game board

the monitor just goes to the 110 transformer, so i doubt this has something to do with the screen width..
« Last Edit: January 04, 2011, 03:59:45 PM by Etienne »

level42

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2011, 03:58:36 PM »
I only see one big blue on that last picture.

Although it can be bad, I have yet to come across a bad one.

Big Blue's (the same as Bob Roberts sells, can now also be ordered from www.flipperwinkel.nl by the way).

I'm not saying it is impossible but it is not very likely that this is the cause.

What you need to find is the vertical width coil and adjust that with a PLASTIC trimmer (not a screwdriver, you will damage it !!!). The width coil can also be already broken...
« Last Edit: January 04, 2011, 04:01:44 PM by Level42 »

Etienne MacGyver

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2011, 04:03:29 PM »
What you need to find is the vertical width coil and adjust that with a PLASTIC trimmer (not a screwdriver, you will damage it !!!). The width coil can also be already broken...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuTlChCko4k&feature=BF&list=PL160A60DABEA7973C&index=27

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2011, 04:07:35 PM »
I only see one big blue on that last picture.

what's the other big blue thing on the right then?

Although it can be bad, I have yet to come across a bad one.

i've heard some people say the same thing, i wonder why everyones saying "you have to exchange those big blues" then? ask sascha ;D

Big Blue's (the same as Bob Roberts sells, can now also be ordered from www.flipperwinkel.nl by the way).

where exactly?

btw, on BR page i found the following: "but a bad Big Blue will manifest many other symptoms from the game being totally dead to the start LEDs flashing to a loud audible hum & more". i do have a loud hum from one of the speakers ...
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2011, 04:18:28 PM »
What you need to find is the vertical width coil and adjust that with a PLASTIC trimmer (not a screwdriver, you will damage it !!!). The width coil can also be already broken...

i remember thosep lastic trimmers you brought along to my place - where can i get those? why not use a screwdriver, why can it damage the width coil. in the video that etienne posted (thx!) the guy says you can also use an allen wrench - would you recommend that?

btw, here's what a monitor chassis looks like that W.O.L sold you as "we have installed a brand new monitor chassis and it was damn hard to find for a med-res monitor like it is used in paperboy"! :shock: :shock: :shock:

all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

level42

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #24 on: January 04, 2011, 04:25:22 PM »
Oops, I had to scroll the window to see it, yes that's another big blue....

No idea,  is that standard according to the manual?

BR is _selling_ those things......


YES they _can_ be bad, but I haven't found a bad one....which doesn't mean it's a bad thing to replace them preventively....but there is also no need to "howl with the wolves" as we say....it's not like a "magic trick" that solves all problems.

In fact,  I don't believe that much in blindly replacing a big blue anymore (or any other caps). Get out your fluke, put it in AC Voltage setting and measure across the big blue's terminals (powered on of course). Tell me what you see and I tell you if it's bad or not.

The monitors you cap-kitted had obvious problems. But if you have a nice working monitor, why bother ? f.i. the MB monitor is great, and I replaced one cap....

Etienne is right: The big blue is filtering the power that runs to the game PCB's. The width of the monitor has little to do with that. The monitor is supplied with 110V.

However, of course it _is_ possible that video circuits on a game PCB are influenced by a badly filtered supply voltage (when a big blue is bad f.i.) and that could cause weird problems on the screen, but not that the width is simply too large.

The thing is: check the basics first. The width of an (old) monitor cannot be adjusted with a pot, there is almost always the width-coil for that. The monitor manual/schematics should point you where it is...

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2011, 04:30:13 PM »
What you need to find is the vertical width coil and adjust that with a PLASTIC trimmer (not a screwdriver, you will damage it !!!). The width coil can also be already broken...

i remember thosep lastic trimmers you brought along to my place - where can i get those? why not use a screwdriver, why can it damage the width coil. in the video that etienne posted (thx!) the guy says you can also use an allen wrench - would you recommend that?

btw, here's what a monitor chassis looks like that W.O.L sold you as "we have installed a brand new monitor chassis and it was damn hard to find for a med-res monitor like it is used in paperboy"! :shock: :shock: :shock:



Mmmm, I've seen worse. In theory it could be a factory mod....

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO no allen wrench, which $%(&^(&*%^ is in that video ?

The thing is that the core of the coil is ceramic which is very fragile and it will BREAK if you use a metal tool.
MABYE, VERY MAYBE it would work if you have a brand new coil, but when it's as old as the monitor, it's bound to be pretty sticky.

Also: if you would use a metal it will influence the function of the coil. So, you will adjust it, look at the screen, think it's OK, remove the tool and the size changes again....but this is only a secondary draw-back.

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2011, 04:31:25 PM »
And BR sells these tool-kits like I had with me...and I think RS has them too.

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2011, 04:33:23 PM »
The width of an (old) monitor cannot be adjusted with a pot, there is almost always the width-coil for that. The monitor manual/schematics should point you where it is...

remember: i don't have a manual ;). but, i think i might have found it :arrow:



on the pcb in front of it it says H. LINE (you can at least read parts of it on the picture). i can't stick anything in there at the very top, but there is this rectangular opening in front of it. would that be the "insertion point"?

and what about those plastic trimmers? where can i get them?
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

Superully

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #28 on: January 04, 2011, 04:36:55 PM »
And BR sells these tool-kits like I had with me...and I think RS has them too.

now all i need to know is what they are called ...

speaking of rs online: i had missed a couple of caps with my first order, so i placed another one. today THREE packages arrived from three different rs locations - of course all with free shipping. i love rs online :-*

all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

italiandoh

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Re: how to ... REMOVE A NECKBOARD???
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2011, 06:45:31 PM »
here are the results of the cap kit (i'm also posting this in my paperboy thread; remember: the picture wasn't perfect (shaky etc.)). while the screen looks nice now (except for the bad colors which are caused by something else)

Bad colors ? Please post a pic of a color bar screenshot or at least a picture in which all three main colors can be seen. Are you sure that in the signals connector R, G and B inputs are matching with the game wiring and are not mixed up ? Please check.

it didn't fix one problem which i had hoped it would: the vertical size. as you can see on the following picture, the screen is too wide and i wasn't able to adjust it with any knob turning

Vertical size ? To me it looks like a horizontal size problem. If turning the H size pot has no or little effect it may also be that they mounted this monitor board on a incompatible yoke. You should check what kind of yoke you have in there. It is usually written on a label on the yoke itself. Or at least measure the yoke resistance with a meter.

is it possible that this is caused by a bad big blue?

No.

Matteo