Author Topic: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor  (Read 49902 times)

ckong

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2010, 03:18:08 PM »
I don't know if this PDF has been mentioned before, or if it is the right thread - but it's been helpfull to me on several occasions - when looking for a TV to replace an arcade monitor.

http://www.kaedebycafeen.dk/pdf/TV-Service-Mode.pdf

Thanks for the link, that will be very helpful.  :)

Superully

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #31 on: August 17, 2010, 12:19:49 PM »
a lot of old b/w games like atari football or boot hill used 23'' b/w monitors.

just out of curiosity (and for another reason ;)): can those 23'' b/w monitors be replaced by 23'' b/w tvs as well?
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

Vnera

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #32 on: August 17, 2010, 01:08:00 PM »
I'have read some where that is is also possible to replace a B/w monitor whit a color monitor. On mosts game pcb's there is a place to tap of the signal for a rgb connector so it displays onli b/w i have read some where that somebody replaced his space invaders monitor whit a color 1

ckong

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2010, 03:13:37 PM »
a lot of old b/w games like atari football or boot hill used 23'' b/w monitors.

just out of curiosity (and for another reason ;)): can those 23'' b/w monitors be replaced by 23'' b/w tvs as well?

Should be, as long as it isn't for a game like for instance Pong. The old b/w tv's aren't capable of handling such a frantic gameplay with quick gamemovements.  :)

Laschek

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2010, 03:28:36 PM »
I guess a little hacking is needed as b/w TVs can't handle the video signal from the PCB (RF/antenna input only, no Scart RGB input obviously ;)).

(Ully, did you read the PM I wrote on AI???)

Superully

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2010, 03:53:47 PM »
(Ully, did you read the PM I wrote on AI???)

nope!!! damn, how could i have missed it? must have been the busy weekend, i'll answer you soon - SORRY!!!
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

level42

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #36 on: August 20, 2010, 09:31:22 AM »
If you have schematics then it is possible to insert the video signal that comes from a b/w game into a b/w TV. However, try find a B/W TV these days......and then the schematics...

I know that it is possible because when I was young (and thus poor) I had a portable B/W TV as a monitor on my Atari 600XL and some (older) friend hacked in the monochrome (=b/w) video signal into it. It looked great.

The very first games like Computer Space had actual TV's in them, and you can bet that they hacked the video signal into them (and did not produce a HF signal from the game PCB that then would be translated back by the TV, that would give a much worse picture and would cost a lot of extra money for the HF converter on the game PCB.

Remember, an (old) TV is nothing more than a monitor with a built-in receiver. Leave out the receiver part and you have a monitor. If you can find where the receiver has decoded the HF signal (the radio emissions that used to go through the air) into the video signal, you can insert the signal of a game PCB there. So you bypass the entire HF decoding section.

Using a color TV instead of a B/W one is possible but I would only suggest it as a last resource. You can feed the video signal to the RGB connections on a SCART to get a picture. However, there are two big disadvantages:

1) convergence. A color TV is never 100% correctly converged. You will see some colors appearing in corners because of (slight) misconvergence. There's nothing to do about that. A slight misconvergence was acceptable and even specified on TV's. It's acceptable because in normal color TV use it is hardly noticeable. However, when you feed a B/W signal, especially one that is so simple as those from the really early games, it will be much more visable.

2) resolution. The old b/w tubes have a much higher resolution (dot-pitch) then color tubes. This is especially clear on B/W vector games, but it's true for all B/W games. Now, with Pong that doesn't really matter much because of the extreme blockiness of the picture, but with f.i. Computer Space or let's say Sprint, where there is much more "advanced" graphics it's more noticeable.

Still......it is a very viable solution if you can't find a real B/W option !!!

The tube size can be a problem though....23" may have been a regular size for B/W tubes, it certainly isn't for color tubes....

This is especially destructive for Video Pinball. The screen has to exactly overlap/match the playfield and the LED's so a different size tube is out of the question. That's why I pray that the one in my VP is still working....
« Last Edit: August 20, 2010, 09:36:24 AM by Level42 »

Superully

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #37 on: August 20, 2010, 02:28:08 PM »
If you have schematics then it is possible to insert the video signal that comes from a b/w game into a b/w TV. However, try find a B/W TV these days......and then the schematics...

thx for your lenghty explanation, andré, another great read full of information. i'm currently trying to find out the exact model that b/w tv is and if it comes with the schematics or if those schematics can be found somewhere on the net. would be nice to have some b/w tvs as spares as well! and it is definitly 23''
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

level42

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2014, 05:41:02 PM »
Don't laugh... I'm sure it'll be very hard to buy new TV CRT like that very soon  :-\ Let's stock them  ;)

Ha ! how right you were Bruno !

Of course this was 6 years ago...try to find NIB CRT TVs now.....good luck !

Anyway, I wanted to ask you something: did you ever open one of those Bluesky TVs ?
I would love to know the CRT number inside :)

Alternatively.....could you make a close up picture of the CRT with like your finger or a euro coin as reference for the size ?

Asking all this stuff because I'd like to see what dot pitch the CRT has....so it has to be really close- up ;) but tubenumber would be easiest...
« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 05:42:52 PM by Level42 »

DarthNuno

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2014, 07:39:29 PM »
All the TV boxed are still... boxed!  :)
I use to get the second hand ones first, keeping preciously the ones in box.
But one of them, the first one from this lot, was used for my Red DK. I'll check the number requested in that cabinet for you, no problem  8)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 08:19:49 PM by DarthNuno »

cebulba

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2014, 08:06:12 PM »
There are a couple of hotels in my area currently selling their TVs for low money (10 EURs each). I may get 40 TVs soon :)

I need them anyway for my exhibition (I currently have 26 TVs) and my console Kiosk Display Units....and it's nice to get 40 TVs of the same size and label.

But where to store them...I need a new "TV Room"  :lol:

Superully

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2014, 09:04:55 PM »
if you don't know what to do with them, i'd gladly take a few off your hands! :)

btw, what do you mean with "26 tvs for an exhibition"?
all i need is ... PONG - and a select few others: TOUCH ME, DRAGON'S LAIR, JOUST, ROBOTRON, MR DO, SAN FRANCISCO RUSH THE ROCK!!!

cebulba

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2014, 09:09:42 PM »
if you don't know what to do with them, i'd gladly take a few off your hands! :)

btw, what do you mean with "26 tvs for an exhibition"?

http://www.retro-spektive.de/ and http://facebook.com/retrospektive and http://www.retro-lounge.com

...and many more websites coming by end of march...exhibition 2014...and the BIG ONE 2015... 8)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 09:13:33 PM by cebulba »

Etienne MacGyver

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #43 on: March 04, 2014, 06:17:55 AM »
I see a familiar guy and a familiar game  :D


Laszo

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Re: Brand new TV to replace old 20" monitor
« Reply #44 on: March 05, 2014, 12:52:22 AM »
I see a familiar guy and a familiar game  :D



Billy Gibbons, Black Beard, Abraham Lincoln  ??? ??? Who is that..... :P