Dragon's Lair Fans - Arcade Lifestyle
General Chat => Arcade Lifestyle => Topic started by: vernimark on September 21, 2014, 04:13:55 AM
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So, I started with my QUASAR restoration.
I already posted some pics but I'd like to have a complete report here so I'm sorry if you have seen some of them. THese are the initial conditions.
- no t-molding on right side
- glass broken
- some scratches
the rest seems to be complete...
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taking picture of some details I could see the headphone grid has a burn. damn!
actually the rest is not in so bad conditions. needs to be cleaned of course, but not so much more...
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and some rust...
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I'll try to repair the glass but probably I've found a new one...
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inside I found all documents: schematics and user manual. I think schematics are already on the web but I'm not sure about the user manual. I had no time to scan it but I'll do that in the next days.
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Serieus restoration this.....great :
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Nice object to restore, keep them pics coming.
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Nice! The US Billiards manual has been scanned that contains schematics but if you have the original manual with original schematics they're worth scanning in HQ (no manual packets I've found in Europe so far had the schematics included).
If the Philips KT-3 monitor doesn't work that'll be the biggest challenge to get going. However, I have a complete manual for the TV flavor of the chassis that is mostly identical to the monitor form (55Mb):
http://www.zzzaccaria.com/manuals/PhilipsKT3ChassisServiceInformation55Mb.zip (http://www.zzzaccaria.com/manuals/PhilipsKT3ChassisServiceInformation55Mb.zip)
Good luck!
Paul.
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Wow, you have a load of work to do!
Love the cab!
Very interested how it will turn out!
Good luck my friend :D
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#sigh# just hoping Kos71 will respond to me on the Quasar PCB he has for me.
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Looking forward to this resto...... you're quite good at it :spaceace:
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Glass update.
I tried to repair it but results are not so good.
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modifications....
this is the first thing I do. I change the default switch with a new one.
In those years SPST switch were used. I change it with a DPDT even if a DPST could be enough.
Here the schematics of both types and a picture (on the left the old one, on the right the new one)
This modification improve a lot your safety working into the cabinet so I suggest to do that.
PS:
SPST = Single Pole, Single Terminal
DPDT = Double Pole, Double Terminal
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Glass update.
I tried to repair it but results are not so good.
Thanks to Spinhacker you have options now :-) Good work so far.
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I think i found an original one...
Spinhaker is helping me a lot with my head on...
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OMG! The transformer has gone!!
Yes, the transformer seems to be short circuited... :'( :'( :'(
and one small part of the fan is damaged too... I'll post a request on the marketplace. and here a picture of the damaged part
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I *really* wouldn't bother fixing the fan. It's almost always audibly. magnetically and electrically noisy by now after 30 years and there are many much improved replacement options - e.g. ADDA AA1282DB-AT 220V-240V 50Hz/60Hz low noise, low power ball fan.
(http://www.zzzaccaria.com/images/Projects/SuperCobraRestoration/SAM_4487w.JPG)
(http://www.zzzaccaria.com/images/Projects/SuperCobraRestoration/SAM_4646w.JPG)
Paul.
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Hi paul, I d like to have a vorking fan only for completeness. I usually don't plug it.
actually the transformer has gone and this is the most important issue i have now...
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OK, well, if you can't get the fan part local I kept all the fans I swapped out so you can have a part off one of those.
Yeah, that power brick looks very burnt :( The transformers are usually very reliable so there is likely a fault in the cab somewhere or it was damaged. There was a guy on UKVAC who parted out a KT-3 based Moon Crest cab and had parts from that - silverfox0786 was his alias.
Paul.
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Hi Paul, if you have one spare I ll appreciate it. I couldn't find one here in italy...
tomorrow i want to try to remove the ac filter. That could be the reason of the short... I hope.
that's a pity because the cab is quite in good general conditions and in case of working transformer this resto can be closed in one week
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OK, I'll fetch the old fans back next weekend and PM you when it's in hand.
Paul.
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Great! :wink:
fast update:
I'm proceeding with the resto. I'm setting up the lights, both not working (marquee and black light)
Here I found a black light replacement:
http://www.ebay.it/itm/171437076855?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
I'm using a power brick from VANGUARD to test all electrical parts but this transformer doesn't support the voltages used by the KT-3 monitor so I've to find a replacement somewhere to close this project.
this week I want to close all aesthetic issues, as t-molding and small scratches.
I've a problem related to the control panel. It is full of cigarettes burns.
Burns are not really a problem , but the plexi is deformed. I'm thinking to put it in my oven making pressure with something put on but I dunno which temperature. I do not want to melt the plastic nor the color
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Silverfox not have the brick from his?
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He sold all parts to a guy that actually didn t need it but he can t remember the name
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It would have been through UKVAC or JAMMA+ so it'd be worth putting out a WTD on those forums. Mention it's from Quasar, Moon Crest & Scramble - someone may have parted one out.
Another possibility is to unwind it (counting the turns) and rewind it with new wire if you have a line/primary side short. It should be a single run with mid-taps (that you don't care about). A short in the secondary's is likely too complicated to rewind yourself.
Paul.
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actually I already removed the wire on primary, but I can't disassemble the blades and it's very difficult to remake the primary with them all around.
I counted the coils and I could see that the ratio is 1:1.8 so 396 coils for 220vac.
PS is it correct to say "coils" or I have to use "loops"? :oops:
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The tabs you can epoxy back in place after the rewind. You've gone far enough along so you might as well rewind it :) You can use a low voltage AC supply to verify your ratios before going full 220V with it. You should be able to get the same gauge of coated wire from a components supply place.
Paul.
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I am in awe of the detail you are going to with this Quasar. Excellent work. Many would have just found another power supply, I include myself in this. Restoring every last piece is fantastic.
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thank you. every time I restore an old cab I learn something new; I try to preserve as many original parts as possible, anyway to buy a new power supply is not so bad ;)
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actually I already removed the wire on primary, but I can't disassemble the blades and it's very difficult to remake the primary with them all around.
I counted the coils and I could see that the ratio is 1:1.8 so 396 coils for 220vac.
PS is it correct to say "coils" or I have to use "loops"? :oops:
You transformer has a core, taps, insulation, windings which have turns....... Just trying to be a smart ass :P
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And all those turns together form a coil ;)
Just think of q*berts worst enemy, Coily. he has many turns in his body which form a coil ;)
http://qbert.wikia.com/wiki/Coily
By the way this is some serious hardcore shit.........I love it ! :)
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:) I studied so many years this stuff but never in english...
going back to my transformer...
I decided to open it completely... in the beginning with bad results but then I could remove the coils block
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THen I took a spare transformer with secondary coils burned (11VAC used for +5V) and I opened this too. Then I removed the primary part from my original transformer and the secondary part from the other transformer.
I made a transfrankenstein (pay attention, not a transexual frankenstein)
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This is the result.
Perfectly working with correct voltages. :lol:
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That's a really great fix :) It would have been cool to see if the rewind worked out ;)
BTW, I PM'd you for your address to send you the fan part.
Paul.
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Ho-ly-shit :shock:
I'm impressed...I would have queued for a new power supply or at least a 'new' transformer :oops:
Great work!! :spaceace:
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Thats hard core MacGyverStyle ! :D
Love it ! :spaceace: :spaceace: :spaceace:
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Thats hard core MacGyverStyle ! :D
Love it ! :spaceace: :spaceace: :spaceace:
+1. Amazing, and very educational for me.
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Thats hard core MacGyverStyle ! :D
Love it ! :spaceace: :spaceace: :spaceace:
+1. Amazing, and very educational for me.
this :spaceace: :spaceace:
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PS: Pay attention to do something similar because you can damage your game...
Probably a lot of you already know that but I want to add this post in order to avoid shocks or other problems.
Primary coil is the part of transformer connected to the power line.
Secondary coil (typically more than one in the same tab) is electrified by electromagnetic induction by the primary coil. no contacts between primary and secondary coils, but they have to be aligned.
I don't want to explain the theory of operation of linear transformers but I just want to say that in order to have a specific voltage on the secondary coil you have to calculate the ratio between turns.
the formula is:
Primary coil voltage : Primary coil turns = Secondary coil voltage : Secondary coil turns
so if you have 220VAC and 300 turns on the primary coil and you want 6.3VAC on the secondary coil you need
(300 x 6.3 ) / 220 = 8.6 (rounded to 9) turns.
So the number of turns is very important. If you want to do something similar to what I did you have to know how many turns your coils have.
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Is there a good kt 3 manual somewhere? My monitor is dead
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The monitor's based off a common TV chassis:
http://www.zzzaccaria.com/manuals/PhilipsKT3ChassisServiceInformation55Mb.zip (http://www.zzzaccaria.com/manuals/PhilipsKT3ChassisServiceInformation55Mb.zip)
Paul.
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thank you!!
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Last step: voltages sticker.
first line: the original
second line: the scan
from the third line repros printed and protected by adhesive plastic
I printed some stickers with 11Vac 4A and some others with 11Vac 10A
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Now it's time to dedicate some time to the coin door.
Metal plate was dirty but in good general conditions so after a fast clean it was ready
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not the same fr the plastic parts.
I had to close a small hole and repaint in silver
fortunately inside the cab I found one L.100 mask saved as spare part so I could use new parts
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Reject buttons and coin return plate were rusted, but nothing tragic
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final pictures not so good but be sure it's nice :)
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Looks nice, too bad for the chrome coin part, but this is better than the destroyed one with the hole.
can you send me the file for those labels ? looks different than the repro's i have, which i still need to put up in my webshop :oops:
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Which labels do you need? I m not sure I can remove safely stichers from coin door.
some hours ago I bought some stuff from your site but I couldn t understand how to pay...
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sorry, wrong screenshots, i mean your repro of the stickers that is one page back.
this is yours :
(http://www.opdenkelder.com/pics/zaccblack.jpg)
and this is the one i created from my CK style powerbrick:
(http://www.opdenkelder.com/pics/zaccred.jpg)
apart from a few amp values, they look the same, can you tell me the measurements so i can compare them ?
I can then just simply change red to black, change the values and add both to the store ;)
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... which i still need to put up in my webshop :oops:
Site updated..
http://www.easywebshop.com/arcadedecals/webshop/218779-zaccaria-vinyl
sorry for the hijack ;)
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here my transformers labels
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This was the control panel as I found it
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then I used sandpaper to remove all burns
and then abrasive cream until I had a glossy surface again
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I damaged the instruction flyers trying to remove it from the CP
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and this is the result
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That's brilliant, I really envy your cabinet skills :)
Paul.
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Nice !!! :spaceace:
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Again: awesome and great work!! :)
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Hardcore! :spaceace:
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:o :spaceace: :spaceace: :spaceace:
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[Flavor Flav]yeaaaaaaaaah boy[/Flavor Flav]
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Thank you guys, but the end is not so close... monitor and pcb are in bad conditions...
Now I'm looking for two coin acceptors blocks as shown in the pictures; Zaccaria code: A5114 :lol: :lol:
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Yeah, I can pull those off something if no one has any local to you :)
Paul.
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wow thanks. now I posted a request on the italian arcade forum... we will see in the next days :D
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I might have a few, will check this weekend. ;)
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Ok, next step: the monitor. these were the initial conditions after a quick cleaning
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Monitor is damaged. I can see that a resistor on the power board has a wrong value (probably).
I think R291 have to be a 1W 4R7 resistor, but there I found installed a R33, too different.
Then I found the BU208 short circuited, so I replaced it.
Obviously I made a complete recap.
Now I have these burned resistor and 1 transistor is missing:
R562 -> 33 ?W, burned
R466 -> 180 1/4W burned and already replaced
T463 -> BUW84 missing
do you know R562 wattage?
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The "Spare Parts List" should be in the manual packet I posted. It has R562 as 33R 0.5W. Note that it also shows R291 as 4R7 wirewound 4W (not 1W).
Paul.
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Thank you Paul, I used another document. colorful but without parts list :lol:
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What's the manual you've found for it?
Paul.
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Thank you for the manuals!!
if someone is boring sitting in the bathroom can read the attached file and tell me if it is enough or something fundamental is missing ;) pay attention it is highly stimulating
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You posted to the wrong topic? :)
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Uff yep!
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I've started looking at my own KT-3 in my US Quasar, not much yet but at least pictures of the daughter boards:
http://www.zzzaccaria.com/USBilliardsQuasarRestoration.htm (http://www.zzzaccaria.com/USBilliardsQuasarRestoration.htm)
Paul.
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very detailed, thank you
Yesterday I replaced burned resistors and shorted transistors.
Plugging the monitor T1463 explodes (it is one of the burned transistors on the chassis)
see pag 1 on this manual
http://www.vernimark.com/arcade/archive/monitor/mon_rc_kt3_serviceinformation.pdf
it is related to the power management but I didn't any other check.
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Ideas:
- Leave T1463 and U7470 out and verify that you have good smooth unregulated DC voltages out of the rectifier.
- Leave T1463 out, insert U7470 and verify you have a square wave in line with the manual at the base of T1463.
Paul.
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Yes, I was thinking more or less the same.
yesterday I dedicated my time to the board. now I've a regular -5V (7905 was faulty) but the board doesn't work yet.
PCB has been repaired by someone used a wrong solder iron; a lot of tracks are broken and I'm doing what I can...
this is the status
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Just this week I've been working on adding Quasar to my little tester. In the next couple of weeks it should be finished.
If you have a Fluke, Macro in the UK has an adaptor for the Z80 to 2650 that can be used.
Paul.
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I don't have a Fluke, I absolutely have to buy one....
That board is a pin in the ass, I'm not sure I can repair it.
this is an example what I found...
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If it's beyond saving I can exchange it for a working in a couple of weeks.
Paul.
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Wow
In the meantime I couldn t resist and I Tried to tepair the board.
Looking at the auxiliary board z80 008/CA1 which is the Ic 13? It seems to be a 7404 but i m not sure.
And ic6 and 7?
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Likely components:
IC6 = 74LS04
IC6 & IC7 = 4016 or 4066
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Thank you.
I found some faulty ICs but I've still problems on the data bus. it seems that more signals are overlapped there and I changed all drivers that access on it. tonight I'll check all enabling signals. On the main CPU reset pin arrives a square wave.
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THen I took a spare transformer with secondary coils burned (11VAC used for +5V) and I opened this too. Then I removed the primary part from my original transformer and the secondary part from the other transformer.
I made a transfrankenstein (pay attention, not a transexual frankenstein)
THAT IS what I call amazing skills and great restoration!!! :shock:
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Thank you... unfortunately I'm not so skilled for other issues. For instance I sent the board to Piero because I was going crazy with that!
This week I'll try to understand the monitor doesn't work...
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There are probably no members restoring on that high level at every aspect.
I am like you, I am vrry good with tools. I can solder, weld, grind, work with a lathe and all that but suck at electronics....but rhere are people who can do it for is was better we ever could, and it is ok that way. :)
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If you want you can :) If you have the patience you can learn a lot of things from this hobby...
Paul, I did what you said.
so on the rectifier board I have 320V instead of 300V bit I dunno how to regulate it because there is just a diode (that I changed but nothing changed) and a little transformer and few resistor used to produce other voltages (I suppose)
So going to the transistor T463 (BUW84)...
Collector: 320V instead of 290 (I don't know if this difference is in tolerance)
Base: I definitely don't have a square wave: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdE8mGsMS8M
looking at the power regulator board I can say that this wave is generated by TDA2581Q. I haven't this TDA but I bought on ebay a couple of them. Once I receive it we can proceed :)
In the meantime if you have any idea how to step down the power from 320 to 300..... :O I'm scared the primary coil of the little transformer has some loops shorted...
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That's probably correct - the unregulated side is somewhat variable based on the mains input. e.g.
240VAC == 339VDC
220VAC == 311VDC
...so your starting voltage looks within range.
Paul.
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This is a good news. On the contrary I think the TDA has gone...
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I ve some doubts. About the ics on the aux board 008/ca1
1=75
2=75
3=?
4=?
5=?
6=?
7=?
8=2114
9=2114
10=244
11=244
12=174
13=?
14=32
Can you help me?
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Yesteraday was the last day... Too much time, to much resources... I have a very long queue and I don't want to spend any other minute on that PCB and on that KT-3 chassis.
I'll continue to restore the cab because I found a glass and the right color to cancel the scratches...
I'll wait to find a new board and a new chassis. Quasar 1 - Vernimark 0
:-[
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It's a battle, I know :(
For the IC's:
3,4,5 - 2 input NAND, 74LS00
6/7 - Quad analogue switch, MC14016B (or MC14066B).
13 - inverter, open collector, 7406
Paul.
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I looked at your you tube. i'm not a scope specialist yet but it looks like a square wave to me. Can you adjust the picture like the horizontal wide and the scan frequency.... I think there is a wave in there. On the other hand I worked with an anolog scope for maybe 10 minutes at school when I was 14 😉
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hehe thank you...
now, waiting for a new board, I'm working on my Vanguard Zac but in a short time I'll come back to this KT3 :D
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Thanks to Paul now I have a working PCB.
Going back to the monitor
http://www.vernimark.com/?p=5065
removing the T465 I haven't any short. obviously nothing works.
Now I want to troubleshoot the part before the T465 in order to have good oscillograms and then I can proceed. Any suggestion is appreciated of course :D
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At least it's trying to do *something*, possibly trying to repeatedly start., and it might not be able to do that with T465 disconnected.
Can you get away with T465 in but with it's secondary windings disconnected from the rest of the circuit? (sleeve the pins to isolate, i.e. LINE O/P SUPPLY & SOUND SUPPLY disconnected) so the transformer is driven has no outputs connected? This would allow you to see if you have a fault on the secondary side that's blowing the power supply and if the power supply will start and regulate the voltage.
If it doesn't start but doesn't blow either, you can then try and add a dummy load to the LINE O/P SUPPLY (e.g. a 60W 240V light bulb) to verify that the supply will regulate the voltage. If you get to this point of a regulated supply with a dummy load then that points to a fault on secondary side, like the line drive transistor or related.
Have you checked to make sure that there is no primary-secondary winding short in T465? You should be able to check for that with a meter. If T465 is actually melted in the windings it'll be hard to check that without a signal generator.
Paul.
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At least it's trying to do *something*, possibly trying to repeatedly start., and it might not be able to do that with T465 disconnected.
Oh, I understand. It is a good point
Can you get away with T465 in but with it's secondary windings disconnected from the rest of the circuit? (sleeve the pins to isolate, i.e. LINE O/P SUPPLY & SOUND SUPPLY disconnected) so the transformer is driven has no outputs connected? This would allow you to see if you have a fault on the secondary side that's blowing the power supply and if the power supply will start and regulate the voltage.
yep, good idea
If it doesn't start but doesn't blow either, you can then try and add a dummy load to the LINE O/P SUPPLY (e.g. a 60W 240V light bulb) to verify that the supply will regulate the voltage. If you get to this point of a regulated supply with a dummy load then that points to a fault on secondary side, like the line drive transistor or related.
Have you checked to make sure that there is no primary-secondary winding short in T465? You should be able to check for that with a meter. If T465 is actually melted in the windings it'll be hard to check that without a signal generator.
Paul.
I'll let you know. In case of short I can try to count the loops and remake it.
I'm scared it can be. I found the monitor with a wire instead of the fuse, so it has been forced to burn
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I could recover pictures from my old broken mobile and now I can document the glass restoration :lol:
The original one was broken so I found another one but with some damages. This is the original
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/quasar028.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/quasar029.jpg)
and this "was" the "new" one
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar154.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar151.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar150.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar153.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar155.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar156.jpg)
I found acrylic colors very similar to the original ones
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar159.jpg)
and I painted filling the missing parts
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar163.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar161.jpg)
The result is not bad, although I'm quite rough in my jobs so probably some of you could reach better results : :ghost:
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar166.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar165.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar164.jpg)
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WOW ! Massive flaking there.
Thanks for the instructions, i have a Space station Bezel that could use some TLC, although its not as flaked as this one yet.
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Great job, looks a ton better than it was !
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thanks ;D
this night I continued to troubleshoot my KT-3
If I can't have any result before friday I'll replace it with an LCD :pac:
I followed Paul's suggestions and I connected the pins 6 and 8 only of T465. I can say It is not shorted...
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar126.jpg)
Then I referred to the technical manual to troubleshoot the regulation board
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar127.jpg)
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar128.jpg)
So I checked points B, D, E and F
B is ok
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar129.jpg)
when I checked D I had a signal that pulsed. Regulating R7317 I could stabilize it
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar130.jpg)
signal after T7353 is inverted as shown in the following picture representing E
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar131.jpg)
Point F, now looks like this:
(http://www.vernimark.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/quasar132.jpg)
this signal is compatible with the technical manual description assuming that "t2" is very close to zero
...and NOW????? :shock: hahaha
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Attach a dummy load to the transformer output, a 60W 240V light bulb may be OK.
If that lights OK and the waveforms look good, then something is wrong downstream. Blown line o/p transistor is a popular choice...
Paul.
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Ok, I don't know what the hell happened but I had another burn on the TV main board. Everytime I dedicate my time to this cab something happens so I decided to stop wasting my time with this cab. I will spend just a couple of hour to re assemble it, board included (thank you again Paul), and nothing else. I want to think about the possibility to use a MTC900 instead of the KT-3 or a Polo (it needs 220V so I haven't to modify anything) waiting for a future KT-3 ::)
I found a purple paint very similar to the cabinet color, I have only to adjust it a little bit with additional black and once I have the same color I'll remove some scratches. That's all...
:pac: :ghost:
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NEWS
some progresses...
an ArcadeItalia user sold me a generic KT-3 chassis. It was quite clean and I cold see someone made a recap.
I removed all tuner circuits, sound board, remote control circuit; then I replaced the input signal board in order to manage RGB directly.
and. IT WORKS!!
I'm fighting with the calibration now but I'm confident I can do it...
The first picture shows the image when I plugged it the first time, then I regulated some pots...
CURRENT STATUS
Connecting the sound board +5V decrease to +1.4 so I have a short somewhere or wrong connection...
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nice progress! :spaceace:
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Show us some pictures of the chassis work you did - I've often wondered if it's possible to convert a standard KT-3 TV chassis.
Good to see you managed to overcome the problem :)
Paul.
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Hi Paul, here the post about the KT-3 swapping
http://www.vernimark.com/?p=5178
probably I have to recap the new chassis as I did with the old one. One day.... :lol:
as you can see nothing so complicated. if you have other specific questions please do.